Where to buy Balsa, spruce, ply etc.

[scamper]

Just wondering where wood can be bought around Dublin. Last time I bought it was from WJ Owens in Bray. Such a pity thats gone. :cry:  
Need it for the wings of a Pilatus B4 I started a few years ago but never finished.
Are there any good online shops?

[Peter]

Hi,

Interested to hear you are building a B4.  Me too - 1/5 scale from a Mike Trew plan but I've only got as far as cutting out the formers so early days yet.  Hope to make serious progress over the winter.  Next step - a larger building board! Which version are you building? Why not try Island Models for balsa!!  Not used them yet but I intend to.  Previous batch of balsa I got was from Inwood in UK over web.  I have also have had good balsa from Green Marine in Harolds Cross, and I got the spruce strips for the B4 wing there recently.

Peter

[scamper]

Hi Peter
Yeah. I'm building the same version. Have the fuselage nearly built.
Think I might try Inwoods because there are few other bits and pieces I need. How much did they charge for postage? Also, did they give you the grades of balsa you asked for?
Were you able to get the wing joiner anywhere? I was thinking about using piano wire and brass tube instead.

[Alan_Perse]

Hi Scamper,
If you are looking for Rectangular wing joiners you can get them from Gilders Distribution, www.gliders.uk.com/ . Just look under the materials heading and then look in the Brass section.

[scamper]

Thanks for that Alan.  
I see they sell airbrakes also. I didnt fancy making the ones shown on the plan.

[Peter]

Scamper,

Very interested to hear you are a bit further down the line on the same B4 project.  Inwoods were OK in terms of wood quality, but they could not supply the spruce spars which surprised me.  The postage from the UK is VERY expensive and has put me off going this route in future. On an order of £71.54, the delivery was £37.75 ..ouch!  Hence my recommendation to try Island Models who I think import from the continent and are based here so it should work out cheaper.

Like you, I was going to go for a piano wire and brass tube joiner system on the B4.  Unfortunately large diameter piano wire is hard to get here - I scoured Dublin before for a joiner for a Sagitta glider I built recently without success.  In the end I managed to get some from SMC in Brighton, UK.  Let me know how you get on with this.  I am also going to go for a different airfoil to that shown on the plan.  I was talking to a chap who built this version of the B4 and he thought that the scale section shown on the plan was not the most efficient in lighter airs so I am going with a thinner Quabeck section.  I guess we can compare performances (eventually!).

Last question - did you build the fuselage in two halves and then join, or did you build one half and then build on the remaining structure?  I was hoping to do the latter.

Peter

[scamper]

That is a bit much for the postage. :shock:  The saving would be cancelled out by the postage.
Not sure what to do with the airfoil. I cant imagine the one on the plan being very accurate on the outer wing panel when the sandwich method is used. Which Quabeck airfoil are you using?
Was looking at the rosenthal site. They use HQ2,5.
www.rosenthal-flugmodelle.com/fuselages.html
This other one uses HQ2   www.icare-rc.com/pilatus_b4_300.htm

It must be about 3 or 4 years since I built the fuselage but I'm pretty sure I did as you said and built one side and then glued the formers to it one at a time. I also used small pieces of ply across the former joins.

[Fred]

Hi Guys (Scamper, welcome to the forum !   )

About the wing joiner, why not using FiberGlass / Carbon rods instead of piano wire ?  :?:
Much easier to find than large size piano wire, lighter... That's what I use on all my gliders. And at 1/5 scale, a 8/10mm rod will be more than enough.

For the wing profile, well, the HQ2.5 will do it, but with built up wings, the accuracy of the profile is only theory... :!:
Depending of the type of flying you want to do the most, you can go for more modern profiles like the SB series (my favourite   ) or why not, the good old Eppler evolution or Ritz profiles.

[Peter]

I am going to use a HQ2.5/12 section so lets see how that works!  I've modified formers 7 and 8 so as to achieve the right root section on the fuselage.   I guess this will be hard to modify if you have already built the fuselage.  I would'nt worry too much as the model with the original section apparently flew fine and only sufferred in marginal lift conditions. Fred - good idea about a carbon rod.  Are Island Models going to stock brass tube/carbon rods or do you have a preferred supplier?

[scamper]

Hi Fred
Never used carbon joiner before. Will look into that.

I never thought about having to modify the formers :oops:   I'll have to get the fuselage out and see if it is possible.

[Fred]

Hi Peter,
Not in stock so far, but that will be the case in the near future. The plan is to stock everything a builder (if there is any left   :lol: ) need !
Favourite supplier  :?:  Try Airtech-rc.com in France. Very good advices !

@Scamper : The carbon rod is a really good alternative to the piano wire.
But... Carbon rods need more care than piano wire as they don't bend, but break suddently (which can be good sometimes, during a hard landing etc etc...)... Need to be checked after each setup for cracks and so on...
The other choice, will be FiberGlass rods.

So far, I never broke a carbon rod in one of my gliders ! I have replaced 2 12mm piano wires in my Lo100 by 2 same by in Carbon... Gain is around 800 grams, and so far, none have broke !  

[IceWind]

What about ply?
Is there any place around in Dublin were to get some?
Or even balsa just to get a single sheet of balsa, I've been looking to see were to get some parts. Like a saw and some thin sand paper.
But it seems this is not a good place for termites!

[garrykeogh]

Hi Ice Wind,
Check with Fred to see what materials Island Models is stocking at the moment.  I am not sure.  Failing that, you could try...

Peter Schweppe's shop on Capel street, Dublin city centre called "The Model Shop" has some materials.  He stocks balsa wood and both lite-ply and the plywood that I used to call miralite.  He has some "stuff" there like glues and covering films but doesn't carry a huge amount.  Norman Greene near Harolds Cross has some useful stuff.  He and one of his staff, a guy called Patrick do some gliding so they generally have a bit of gear.  His stuff is ever so very slightly VERY F***ING OVERPRICED if you ask me!  I always get only what I needed (no impulse purchases) and leave with a lot less money than I expected :roll:

The lite-ply is good to replace balsa but where you need to make sure it won't split along the grain.  It is perfect for a former that is not loaded, laminated to make servo mounts or something like this.  The ply I called miralite is available from 0.4mm to 3mm in small sheets.  I have used this for wing joining braces and heavily loaded formers as it is very strong especially when you laminate several layers with epoxy, clamped together while drying.

By thin sand paper, do you mean fine grit?  If you want fine grit sand paper, try to avoid places like Woodies!  A trade type motor factor will stock a range of Aluminium Oxide and Silicon Carbide paper from 40 grade through to 1200 grade.

Hope that this info is some use to you?  Where abouts in Dublin do you live?  This may make a difference which shop you visit.

Garry

[IceWind]

Thanks Garry!
That is really usefull!

I'm near the center, Clontarf. Also as i have a car i can go a bit further away!
I wanted the ply to do some servo mounts.
Also the balsa i need one sheet only, i saw the stocks in island models but its a 10 pack but i think i go for that. I can keep the rest to build something!

But is good to have a place to get this stuff right away. Not for big purchases.

Regarding the sand paper yes i mean a a fine grit! As i haven't found any that was thin enough i bought some nail files.
It was enough for what i wanted at the time and now my nails look awesome!
But the problem is that they are small, and to sand a bigger area it doesn't work.

Nando

[Fred]

Hi Fernando,

The 10 pack for balsa is because of the shipping... Not easy to send only one sheet of balsa !  :roll:

Let me know what you need or looking for, and we can meet at the slope and I'll give you the stuff !  

Mind you, not everything is on the website yet for building materials, but we pretty much have everything ! Not a lot of interrest in Ireland for wood and so on, so we are a bit slow updating this section !  :oops:  :oops:

Let us know.

By the way, how the glider is coming ?

Fred